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designated players
vietnam star or league minimum
Did I just learn why the negotiations over the collective bargaining agreement are so contentious? Did I find out just how disrespected the Vietnam league is? Or did I discover that MLS doesn’t think he’s worth it? There is plenty to learn from the professional path taken by Lee Nguyen, but at present, all I have are questions.
Talking to Nguyen back in November of last year it seemed certain he would be playing in a MLS uniform in 2010. Once high school player of the year and college freshman of the year, as recently as last fall Arsenal had nice things to say about the 23-year-old Texan who played within the national team system at almost every level. He’s spent time at PSV Eindhoven, Randers FC, and HAGL in Vietnam. In an environment where nearly every talented young American player runs from MLS to foreign countries for better competition and compensation, here is a guy who wants to come back home. Done and done, right? So why am I waking him up at 6:45 AM in Vietnam—Lee thankfully awake from the half-day time change and jet lag before his new season starts at the end of the month?
It has been a while since his last national team call-up, and he is not even listed in the 2009 national team player pool, So what kind of contract offer should he be expecting to get from MLS? Turns out, as reported by 3rd Degree, Nguyen gets an offer from MLS similar to what he left on the table when he went to Europe after one year of college instead of signing a Generation Adidas contract with MLS… So that American kids don’t initially skip signing with MLS to only return a few years later for more money? Isn’t that the free market? Vietnam, a relatively smaller but freer fish than MLS, and one with an ancestral interest in the young player whose family has roots in the country, will undoubtedly offer more than the frugal American top flight, but what would be reasonable upon his return now?
MLS does not comment publicly on negotiations with any prospective player, but according to Nguyen, MLS offered the league minimum for 5 years.
TIAS: You wrote on Twitter that the deal MLS offered you just wasn’t worth staying for. Can you go into any more detail as to why that was?
Lee Nguyen: It’s a no-brainer really. Basically the offer was the league minimum for 5 years.
And it was really the league minimum, no more than that?
No more than that. I knew before coming back that I was going to have to take a pay cut, and I didn’t mind that at all. Because it was based on me wanting to come back and show my ability and get my name out there to the fans in the States. But for the league minimum for five years I just couldn’t take it.
I guess I am surprised Dallas or another interested team wouldn’t push MLS to give you more money if they wanted you to stay and sign.
My agent told me there were teams interested and obviously Dallas was one of the ones I was interested in being so close to home. But finding a club wasn’t the problem, we were trying to get the right contract with the league. I was willing to compromise and come back for a pay cut or have a performance-based contract, having something progress within the next couple of years–maybe something after the first or second seasons it goes up if I play well–but they wanted to lock me down for five years at the minimum, so I had other things to consider. Not just me but my family, taking care of them as well. And I couldn’t even take care of myself if that was the case.
Does this leave a bad taste from the whole experience or are you just moving on?
Now I know why so many players in the league are frustrated. I guess for now it’s just how it is working out. So I just got to put it behind me and look forward and hopefully look at some more options next year or the year after that. We definitely tried to come back but it just didn’t work out this year.
What is the state of your contract in Vietnam?
I have this season and next season, and then I’m a free agent. But we would possibly be able to do some sort of loan in August, depending on how well this season goes. We’ll see.
Run through the dates of the Vietnam league so people know when to look for you on the field.
It starts on January 31st and runs all the way to August.
And what’s the reaction been in Vietnam to your return?
They’re happy. We’re all happy. The owner is glad to have me back. We have a new coach who I trained with for the first time on Tuesday, so I think we are going to have a good season this year.
—-
Nick
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 7:02am
I was hoping to see Lee play in MLS as I’ve never seen him play and the last interview TIAS did with him was super interesting, that being said, league minimum for 5 years is a garbage offer! Why wouldn’t MLS want an American with proven ability, who was good enough to train with Arsenal, and who is ready to take a REASONABLE pay cut to play in MLS? It’s a disgrace.
Chris
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 7:14am
For a league that prides itself on making smart financial decisions, they have more than their fair share of head scratchers. Very short sighted in some respects.
Just from a marketing/PR perspective Nguyen would’ve been a great way to grow a fanbase in at least part of a large Asian community in the U.S.
Investing in the success of a home grown Vietnamese talent, who should be part of the player pool by the way, would be a minimal risk. The return from proper marketing could’ve been the addition of at least a part of the Vietnamese community to MLS’ small fanbase, not to mention added ticket and jersey sales.
Why haven’t the Sounders seen the potential in adding a Japanese player to their roster?
MLS misses so many golden opportunities to invest in its fanbase.
Peter C
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 8:00am
Is there any way to verify the offer made to Lee? Young first year players are only obligated to a team for 4 years.
The deal Lee describes defies all logic, even for the notoriously cheap MLS.
Andrew Kiet Phong
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 8:10am
lee is a great footballer but just that his hard work hasnt been shown in the media and public. He goes strength by strength every minute his on the field, i reakon that he could make the World Cup team but only in one condition, if he moves immediately, i dont think he could have any chance to making it to the us side in time if he doesnt, the move to vietnam was a bad one i have to admit in my view, but in all due respect lee good luck, you could try the A-Leauge in australia, its not that bad, around Championship./league one in england but definately better than V-leauge. but best advice, go and play in a big league, mayb Turkish league.
Adam
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 8:11am
I don’t disagree Peter C, but MLS when contacted gave the expected reply as noted above (i.e. no comment), so other than Lee, I don’t have another way to verify any specifics about any deal that MLS did or did not offer him.
Greg
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 10:20am
If it matters, I can verify (from a separate source) that this was the MLS offer. And I can add that they also wanted to give utter peanuts to HAGL for the fee.
Adam
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 10:30am
Thanks Greg.
and that my friends wraps up today’s lesson on having good sources.
Fan
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 10:31am
This is a rare occasion when I back a lowball offer by MLS. This kid is a legend in his own mind.
Cade
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 10:43am
highly disappointed with the league. Would of been great to have another young talented U.S. player to watch grow in our domestic league.
jorsh
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 11:18am
Fan, it’s one thing for it to be a lowball offer for an unproven talent, but to lock him in for 5 years? If they think that poorly of him, then why 5 years? If he took it and played well, he’s screwed. And if he played poorly then they could just drop him. No risk for the league but also no incentive for the player.
John
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 11:37am
I think you have to realize that the teams now hold most of the power in MLS when it comes to salary. If Dallas or another team really wanted Lee they would tell the league they would sign him for X plus how much they would be willing to pay his Vietnamese team. Obviously no one really wants him too badly.
I suppose I could be wrong, but I don’t think so. When DC wanted Troy Perkins they had to move heavan and earth to get him. Pay him large salaray, pay transfer fee to Norwegian team and make trade to get his rights (through allocation list). They felt they needed him since Wicks is injured and they don’t think he’s that good when healthy anyway.
Chicho
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 11:40am
Andrew, you’re a moron. Lee is short, slow, and not athletic at all. Viet Nam’s national team and league sucks big time. Lee is not deserving of a good MLS contract and you think he could make the world cup squad where he’d be competing against players in the premiership and bundesliga? Seriously? You are “bloody clueless mate”.
3rd Degree » Archive » What Happened with Lee Nguyen?
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 11:50am
[...] 2: Lee says MLS offered him 5 years at league minimum. Verifying exactly what I was talking about in this [...]
Tino007
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 12:02pm
I believe slavery was fought against and thrown out in 1865. Does anyone recall the civil war. The MLS is made up of a bunch of rich guys who think that their money was given to them by God himself. Soccer in America is a joke. In 1975 Willie Mays was the highest paid baseball player in Major League Baseball. He was making $125,000 a year. The MLS pays players $34,000 a year and developmental players make $17,500. This is cow dung. How can a person live in Boston, NY, San Jose and live on this. It is time that to get rid of this league and human abuse. American kids are being used by these rich guys. Pay the players a good living or go close up shop. We really don’t need professional soccer in the US if players are going to be treated like this.
Brooklyn Dave
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 12:43pm
I understand why the MLS needs to be extremely conservative with its non-core player salaries and contracts. The league is designed to grow at a (often frustratingly) deliberate pace, and survive the economic cycles. That’s a good thing given the history of professional soccer leagues in the US. The MLS scouting of Nguyen obviously indicates a replacement level player in their view, ie, he’s in the fat part of the talent curve where the next guy who wants to get into the league is at roughly the same level as Lee. What disturbs me isn’t the league minimum offer - that just reflects their assessment of his level of play. What disturbs me is the irrational five year duration with no incentives. That is counter-productive to the MLS’s goals. They should be building incentives into ALL of their contracts. What happens when a guy feels he’s played really well but is still getting the league minimum? He jumps the league at the first opportunity. Athletes need a carrot out in front of them. So that would be my question for MLS - what the heck is the purpose of a five year contract at league minimum?
Brian
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 2:23pm
So that American kids don’t initially skip signing with MLS to only return a few years later for more money? Isn’t that the free market?
MLS made him an offer, and he thought it was too low so he rejected it and accepted a better offer. It’s the definition of the free market.
Dave
on Jan 22nd, 2010 - 11:37pm
Tino007, you do realize that soccer is not a money making operation in America, do you? These owners have been taking huge loses to try to keep the sport intact. Moron.
Scotty
on Jan 23rd, 2010 - 6:20am
Every College kid that gets drafted should be exploring overseas options. Why do you think Stuart Holden is looking to move on, he is a National Team player and was only making the League minimum. MLS needs to wake up and at least pay these kids a living wage, or like Lee said, throw an incentive package together. I also believe these are not guaranteed contracts, if they don’t like you they can release you with no compensation. $17500 is barely above minimum wage based on a 40 hour week. I saw Lee play his freshman year for Indiana and I can honestly say he was a better player than some of this years first round picks and GA players. After playing professionally for the last 3 years he can only have improved and had to be worth more.
poolfan
on Jan 23rd, 2010 - 7:16am
Dave:
Where did YOU verify that “these owners are taking huge losses…”. You mean you are actually taking the owners’ word for it? What planet are you living on? Sports owners in general are notorious for issuing releases like that when, in fact, they are making a lot of money on the game. Just look at how much it costs to get a new franchise in MLS. Where do you think that money goes - to Haiti?
Look at the Glazer situation in Man U where Mal’s sons got caught with their hand in trhe cookie jar, taking close to $4 million out of the club last year alone in “administrative fees” and so-called loans. Wake up and fgrow up.
Paul
on Jan 23rd, 2010 - 8:18am
If the MLS Players Union is unable to negotiate higher league minimum salaries, then it must seek to reduce the time until a player is available for free agency. If it is currently five years of service before a player can obtain free agency, it should be reduced to three. This will allow a player’s a little leverage and a lot of incentive.
Sgc
on Jan 23rd, 2010 - 1:42pm
tino007,
Did you just compare the average guy earning the minimum with Willie f*&T&(%^ing Mays? Wow, way to destroy your own argument!
A) MLB had been around (measuring from the NA) for 104 years by this time
B) Willie Mays is one of the top dozen or so players of all time
C) Landon Donovan makes more than Mays did, even adjusted for inflation. Heck, even Shalrie Joseph or Dwayne DeRosario make about as much.
But congratulations on giving people a brand new perspective on how much MLS has achieved in such a short period of time!
al
on Jan 23rd, 2010 - 4:17pm
What kind of message does this send to our young US players out there? Surely MLS can find mediocre players from poor countires to come on those terms but this does not do anything to develop homegrown international stars. Lee! you’ve done the right thing! Stay where you are appreciated. MLS will eventually learn that this is not the way to treat its US upcoming talent.
con man
on Jan 23rd, 2010 - 4:42pm
MLS is cheap but it’s starting to make profits in this tough economy and growing still. I don’t blame the kid for playing in VN based on just the amount of money and fame. As one guy said, Nguyen’s a legend in his own mind which is exactly what it is but he’s being worshiped in VN also. But things will change in MLS after this Jan. 31st, as the league’s five-year labor contract expires on Jan. 31st. So let’s see how this CBA turns out!!! The chance for him to get on US national team again is getting slimmer and slimmer.
One of the differences between MLS and V-League is MLS is a pro-league while V-League is just a semi-pro-league. Most of teams in VN are state-funded and some other teams (Nguyen’s team is in that group) are just toys of some rich owners, and none of those teams makes any profit!!!
Eric in Baltimore
on Jan 25th, 2010 - 11:23am
I think the message to young American players is this: If you think you are as good as all your coaches have been telling you, by all means, go out there and get a better contract. If you fail to catch on, don’t come crawling back to MLS demanding compensation on a par with players that have, you know, achieved something. Unfortunately, we have only his word against the league’s non-word. There’s no need to rend garments and gnash teeth here. If the offer wasn’t good enough, then he was wise to decline. Unless, he actually places value on performing in a real league.
Jason
on Jan 26th, 2010 - 2:04am
For those of you who talk crap about Lee and his abilities get a fing clue. Gus Hiddink thought highly enough of him to sign him. I’m gonna go with Gus on this one. Some of you claim that he must not be good enough because the league offered him peanuts. Please don’t put too much faith in the leagues ability to value players. There are too many examples of good players playing overseas because the MLS said they weren’t good enough. Anton Peterlin anyone?
Fan
on Jan 26th, 2010 - 7:47am
Jorsh - I didn’t say anything about the length of the contract. Five years is too long, but the money was just right.
Scotty - Stuart was offered opportunities to sign a new deal in the middle of his original one, and he chose not to. I’m not criticizing him, but this notion that MLS didn’t try to reward him is absurd. He chose to go on a free.
Paul - there is no free agency in MLS. This is what the players want (and I support).
Jason - Hiddink thought highly enough of him … in 2006. It’s not 2006 anymore. Peterlin was on the MLS radar and multiple teams wanted him, but he chose to go to Europe. You win some, you lose some.
I find it funny that people think MLS doesn’t value young talent when they just gave Danny Mwanga 200K and signed a dozen or so other young players before the draft. They also will probably get Luis Gil. They do reward young players, but they don’t overpay for players who think MLS should move heaven and earth for them after they flame out with multiple teams in Europe.
Lee Nguyen needs to stop reading the stories about him from 2005.
Sean
on Jan 26th, 2010 - 3:02pm
Have to wonder what is going on with Nguyen. I don’t know what type of money he is getting in Vietnam but I can guess that the quality of play isn’t as good as even the lower leagues in Europe. Is he giving up on personal development? I remember his initial contract with PSV being pretty decent for a 19 year old youth team player, much better than he could have gotten with MLS. Leaving for lack of playing time doesn’t make sense either if the playing time is in a semi pro league as others have said above.
Links | TheOriginalWinger.com
on Jan 26th, 2010 - 4:08pm
[...] star or league minimum? – TIAS a2a_linkname=”Links”;a2a_linkurl=”http://theoriginalwinger.com/2010-01-26-links”; Share [...]
J
on Jan 26th, 2010 - 10:53pm
There is no reason for the MLS to continue to function as a single entity structure (players negotiate and sign contracts with MLS, not the individual teams). If the league is concerned with the teams overspending, put a salary cap in place. It’s a simple solution that works in every major American sports league (including the NBA and NFL).
The only reason Don Garber wants the league to remain single entity is so that he can screw players over that passed up MLS to play for major clubs like PSV (Lee), Manchester United (Kenny Cooper), and Blackburn (Stu Holden). Garber’s goal in life is to get back at those players for hurting his delicate little feelings…poor little Donnie.
30K a year for 5 years is a joke, and I can confirm it was the offer. Hopefully the MLS players don’t back down on this point in the CBA negotiation and guys like Lee can come back to the States to play in front of their fans.
Eric Lantana
on Jan 28th, 2010 - 12:25pm
The mls is in big trouble if they dont give a better deal to the players. The ussf has the nasl ready when the mls falls in a few weeks. Don garber is a complete joke.
Scotty
on Jan 29th, 2010 - 9:21pm
Fan, what did they offer Holden?? It was probably peanuts and I guarantee you he is making much more with Bolton. Also, why wouldn’t he take a free, if he had a contract and Bolton came in for him and the MLS transferred him he wouldn’t get his percentage of the transfer fee. The way Stuart did it makes it more financially rewarding for the player.
Michael
on Jan 30th, 2010 - 5:26pm
There are plenty of people in the US that don’t make anywhere near $30,000 a year for playing a game. They work full time and do honest work, so if you’re going to start making comparisons to slavery (Really? SLAVERY?) you might consider teachers or nurses first before you start freaking out about pro athletes.
I mean, I think the league minimum should be raised as well, but some of the rhetoric here is absurd. Don Garber isn’t a cartoon villain and I’m sure he doesn’t live to ruin players lives (BTW - Cooper came back from Man Utd for family issues, MLS eventually sold him on when the time came. Same for Stu. They’re hardly victims, being that they both got exactly what they wanted). MLS is going to change, but ending single entity isn’t the magic solution some people think it would be. Look at the NHL.
J
on Jan 30th, 2010 - 9:59pm
Michael,
Here is an excerpt from an interview with Kenny Cooper Senior about his son’s experience in MLS and how he feels young Americans are mistreated by the league.
“The young kids are sitting back and watching this unfold and thinking, ‘what’s my incentive to stay with my hometown team?’,” Cooper asks. “But if they go overseas, and come back, they’ll be told ‘you went overseas, you didn’t stay in the system, so we’re going to pay you $24,000.’ It’s just not a level playing field when it comes to Americans.”
I’m not sure I follow your MLS vs NHL logic? Please clarify.
knowitall
on Mar 6th, 2010 - 1:29pm
MLS is a joke….a very very bad joke….the people who offer players contracts are all in the FO of MLS….they have more than likely never seen these guys play(or at least frequently), how are they supposed to know the value of any player to the team he plays for….it doesn’t make since
MLS Corner Kick
on May 16th, 2010 - 9:32pm
MLS needs to pay its players!
REINHARDGEHLEN
on May 21st, 2010 - 12:55pm
Interesting and informative football site. I would like to suggest that the web-master for this site correct all the error scripts so that the pages would display correctly in Firefox. Without script corrections this website is not Firfox friendly….. bummer.
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