This Is American Soccer, US Soccer, MNT, WNT, and MLS - Tackling the subject of Soccer in the US, and worldwide.

EDITOR IN CHIEF OF FUTBOL MUNDIAL IS BREAKING DOWN BORDERS,

WAITING FOR AMERICAN SOCCER TO CATCH UP

Robert Abramowitz has a drool-inducing resume: Television Commentator/Anchor - ESPN International (Latin America) & ESPN Deportes (US) - May 1994 – Present. Radio Commentator - NFL/Westwood One/Univisión Radio - November 2003-Present. Radio/TV Play-by Play/Analyst - New York Knicks - May 1996 – Present. Television Voiceover/HBO Sports - August 2001 – Present. And of course, Editor in Chief - Fútbol Mundial - May 2002 – Present.

And that’s just the stuff he is presently working on, to say nothing of his past. So, um, Robert might have a thing or two to say about Hispanics and American sports. You can find Part 1 of our conversation here; we pick up with the state of Futbol Mundial and FM USA after the jump.

Was it an absolute requirement that everybody working at Deportes or Futbol Mundial be Spanish speakers? Or could you hire someone who didn’t and just translate his or her work?

No, it wasn’t a necessity. For example, we did hire translators, and I set them to translating all the English stories I needed from the flagship site into Spanish. That was very important to me to use all the content that was relevant. Some content was un-gettable other ways. I mean, who has Chris Mortenson’s contacts? And I mention him because he was always happy to see it because his mom is Honduran.

Take me through the growth of Futbol Mundial.

We started out quarterly, just kind of playing it by ear. The second year we did six issues. The next year we did twelve. Then we launched Béisbol Mundial. And in 2006 we launch Futbol Mundial USA, which is our English language product. That is very important for us, very important. We’re supporting it right now because it hasn’t
attracted the advertising it should because it’s a wonderful product with great writers and enormous distribution. We have all the best writers in the country that you know from elsewhere writing exclusive content for us. Six times a year we print 400,000 copies and distribute it through the USA Today Sports Weekly.

That’s the rub for me. It is huge distribution, but until I met you I had never heard of it because I never pick up a USA Today Sports Weekly.

Right, and that’s obviously a problem. It’s on 50 or 80,000 newsstands throughout the country. In most airports. Getting the magazine in readers’ hands is the hard part though.

This seems like as good a place as any to pull back from your experience to the greater market. You’ve helped launch ESPN Deportes.com, and two three Futbol Mundial magazines. What have you seen in that time gives you hope for the editorial future or fear?

In many ways the future is very good, especially for the Spanish market. We were first to market. There was nothing in the space before. Futbol Mundial in Spanish is the #1 sports magazine in Spanish and the #1 men’s magazine in Spanish. Nobody has our reach, nobody has our distribution, nobody has our circulation. We print over 1 million copies monthly. Our readership tops 2.8 million readers every single month. If you go out to Spanish communities in L.A. or somewhere with a soccer-mad audience – Felix tells me this all the time – go into any garage and ask about it, and guys will pull it out.

What are the differences between the Spanish and USA versions of the magazine? Totally different?

No. Not totally different. We actually use stories that go back and forth. Some English stories are translated to Spanish and vice versa. There is a lot of common ground. Obvious examples like player profiles on big stars can go into both editions. On the English side, for example, we’ll throw in stuff about Mexico that you won’t get anywhere else. It’s interesting, We did a primer on Mexican soccer and just broke it down. We had Mark Ziegler from San Diego and Andrea Canales write a series of articles about how the top division works, what the confederation is like, who the teams are, how they play, how they break up the season. We got such great response from that. Lots of people wrote us wanting us to do it for other countries. We did it for Mexico because for better or worse American soccer is married to Mexican soccer. They may be enemies on the field, but the federations are making tons of money together as partners. I love it! It’s a fantastic partnership. They have expanded it to the point where great things are happening. It becomes about the region, the continent, not just one country. Concacaf obviously loves it. It raises the bar for everybody.

So there are some mutual interests between the two magazines and we won’t shy away from them or pit one content against the other. The best thing that I can see and one of the reasons why I cover a lot of American soccer in Spanish – I treat the US MNT as a home team and the Mexican national team as a home team – because Mexico is our most important readership. I think its like 68 percent of our readership TK is Mexican. We know who pays the bills. At the same time, they have to understand that for soccer to be successful in this country the US MNT has to be successful too. And hey, if you come from a different country and you are living here now, don’t think of the U.S. as your enemy. Its just the contrary. Now I don’t expect you, if you are Mexican and the U.S. is playing Mexico, for you to come root for the U.S. If I was living in Mexico and the U.S. played, I’m rooting for the U.S. But if you are here and the U.S. is playing anybody else, I’d like to see your support. I think its important; I think its great for the growth. And I think the U.S. has to start pushing for that. And I think that is where U.S. soccer has really failed. They’ve never activated the Hispanic market in that way. There’s been some minor pushes here and there; you hear Andres Cantor saying “the national team of everybody” and all of that but it hasn’t gotten the type of push that it really needs to get all these soccer fans – over 42 million Hispanics in this country – to support MLS and the national team. That should be enough to support it alone. I’m not asking for rabid fans, just supporters. You could begin to eliminate all of these home games for the U.S. that end up being road games. That is ridiculous that that happens. The thing I find great when I go to games is seeing somebody – I saw this at Giants stadium not too long ago: a guy wearing a Columbian jersey and waiving a U.S. flag.

I saw a guy in Columbus for the big qualifier who had split his Mexican jersey and U.S. jersey in half and sewed the two halves – green and white – together. And also fathers with Mexican jerseys on and their kid with U.S. jerseys on. So even with out this push from USSF or MLS, it is starting to happen. Paul Gardner has to like that.

Me too! That’s what I want to see. We are a unique country. There is no country in the world that has ex-pats of so many different countries like we have over here, who love the sport, who could be the back-bone of the sport in this country. And I don’t think you have to only market to them, just like you don’t only have to market to the soccer mom. You can do heavy marketing to both to get them into stadiums. Although it has gotten better, it is not even close to where it should be. And its taken too damn long to get where it should be. Besides the inaugural year, which was the best for MLS?

This year.

And why?

I know you want me to say because they brought in Hispanics.

Because they brought in a whole bunch of Hispanics. And oh by the way they were very good. Oh by the way we attract fans too.

And Sponsors. Best Buy just signed on to be the Chicago Fire jersey sponsor, and people are saying its because they want to expand into the Hispanic U.S. Market

That’s a great story. That’s what you have to see. This is what they have been blind to. This is why Paul [Gardner] bangs his head against the wall. He’s been writing the same thing for years because no one is listening to him. And then all of a sudden MLS does this… ‘Oh yeah, great idea, glad we thought of it.’

Why did it take them until recently?

Because everybody looks East. It’s easier for people who speak English to find other people who speak English. You can communicate with them. It’s easier. This is what they know. You always go to the places that you know. That’s where you find comfort and support. This year they finally decide ‘ok, we are going to try a different tact.’ So Columbus gets Guillermo Barros Schelotto, He is their best player, ok. FC Dallas brings in Juan Carlos Toja, who turns out to be a great player. Juan Pablo Angel, Blanco, and it doesn’t stop there.

And the phenomenon continues this year. Maybe not as maybe big names, but more numbers per chance with the rule changes.

Don Garber many years ago kept on telling me when I would ask him why they weren’t bringing in more Hispanic players, ‘well we tried it with Luis Hernandez and it was a disaster.’ So you got one player who is definitely on his way to being over the hill, and he didn’t score goals in bunches but also didn’t play poorly mind you. He wasn’t great, but he didn’t suck. And that one player is a failure and they aren’t going to do it anymore. I’m glad something changed up there and they decided to try again. You can’t argue with the success the league is having now, and I give Don credit, but everything hasn’t been great; I think he has been slow on some things.

Yeah, I tend to support his work. The slow-growth model has worked well so far. Whether it will continue to, we will see. But no doubt we should have been linking with Mexico, Central America and foreign countries in general from the very beginning.

Just sign the right players. You are going to make mistakes – Like Dallas did with Denilson, but

Reyna!?!

Well, everyone knew that one was a mistake, and nobody freaking listened. Nice guy, skilled player. local guy. But he has a terrible history of injuries. Missed major portions of several of the last seasons and you are going to play him in the middle of summer on fake grass in Giants Stadium.

A recipe for disaster.

And to bring him in as a Designated Player. I mean, 400,000 for what he gives you seems more than fair. Emilio did it. Who was better last year? I was against that signing from day one. This isn’t second guessing.

Neither is my urge to bring in the Mexican fan. I remember talking to Sunil [Gulati] about it before he became president. I told him you need to have your website in Spanish. You need a Spanish public relations department. The perception – and I don’t know if it’s a reality or not – but the perception in the Hispanic community about the USSF and the Hispanic media in this country is that it’s us versus them as opposed to trying to embrace them by reaching out and saying, ‘hey, we want to work with you. We want you to cover us like a home team for you your domestic audience. We’re going to make it easy for you. What can we do? You are our friend. We want to bring you into our family. We want to treat you like family.’ But no.

If he called you and said, Ok, let’s do it Robert. Would you go?

Well, it’s different. My relationship with Sunil is different. I’ve know him since he was 15-16 years old. But you know the USSF, even though we are the largest Spanish soccer magazine in the country, largest Spanish men’s magazine in the country, they did not accredit us for the World Cup. Sunil wasn’t president then and I complained to Sunil. And his hands were tied at the time, and I was like fine, but surprised. I had to go through FIFA directly to accredited.

And that was easy? They were quick to approve it?

Yeah. Paul Gardner helped out a lot. But obviously they see the value in reaching 2.8 million Spanish readers a month. USSF’s reasoning was that they had a limited amount of credentials that FIFA gave them, and they had given some of them out to all the major Spanish newspaper in the U.S.

Do those papers’ numbers compete with yours?

Well, we distribute our magazine in all those papers and plus a whole ton of other ones.

Were you laughing it seemed so ridiculous?

No, I was furious. But I don’t see it happening again, hopefully. The sport could just grow so much faster if they can reach the Hispanic market. And I’d like to think we could help in that regard.

We’ve been talking about a lot of the changes. Have we turned the corner yet?

They are turning the corner. I think MLS has turned the corner. They understand the value. I think Sunil definitely understands the value. I just wish that it would happen quicker. I wish they would create a PR department, create an internal campaign to really embrace media and bring them in to write about soccer in this country. It doesn’t have to be flattering or even supportive, just cover the sport here. Consider the US national team as your home team. We have a lot of Hispanic players on the U.S. team. Bocanegra, Feilhaber, Mastroeni, Reyna, Tab Ramos, it goes on. Balboa. Tons of guys. Do something to show that it is alright to say, ‘my parents are Argentinean, but this is my national team.’

There is your commercial right there: ‘My National Team’

Sure. And put it on Spanish TV. Use some of that vast money USSF has. Propaganda is good. Propaganda works.

If I have to choose one thing to change – and this isn’t revolutionary - but the lack of marketing has to be it. MLS is based here in NYC. Red Bulls too. Sunil lives here. The city is one giant billboard. Nothing about soccer. No posters. No media spots. No half naked MLS players, yet Henry is plastered here and there and some of the other model-y European players. It’s just sad.

Well, the media in New York is just brutal to soccer. Nowhere is as bad as New York. DC, Boston, Chicago all cover their teams pretty well.

I guess I just don’t understand the marketing, and honestly, in my own work, I try to avoid it. I don’t want to know really. I’m not a business guy. I want to write a story, turn it in and move on. Now of course marketing and advertising allows a magazine to pay me, but I don’t want that to affect me.

One of our missions editorial in Futbol Mundial is show that there is a passion for the sport on both sides of the ledger and Hispanics should embrace American soccer. And that’s why we cover it the way we do. It makes me think of my favorite moment from the last World Cup. I had just driven to where the U.S. was playing Italy, and we parked the car and next to us a car parks and out comes three guys dressed with their Mexican jerseys. I looked at them and was like ‘oh that’s cool. They are here to watch the game.’ They go to their truck, take off their shirts and out come three U.S. shirts. And I was like, ‘Felix, check this out! this is what we want!’ I go over and chat with the guys. They were from Riverside, California; they had just driven from Hanover where they watched the Mexico-Angola game. They had tickets to every U.S. and Mexico game, and they were supporting both teams.

That’s the utopia. And it’s not an unattainable utopia.

They exist!

They do exist, and its about marketing. It’s about we embrace you, not we’re your enemy. And that’s the perception. You know in Columbus for the qualifier, I ran into a group of Mexican fans and asked one guy how he got tickets for the game, because I know that they tried desperately to stack it. He was from St. Louis and had purchased season tickets for the Columbus Crew, which gave him the option to buy the national team tickets. He threw out every ticket, he said, for the Crew, and came to just this game.

Wow. That’s die hard. The marketing now, what there is, definitely plays up the rivalry, and not in the most healthy way. That guy will probably never root for a U.S. anything, but the rivalry should be a brotherly thing. It’s gotten a little nasty of late. But the dark side sells tickets too, which is fair. Yet it furthers the schism between the two fan bases.

What I want to see when the U.S. plays Sweden at the Home Depot Center in L.A. (editor’s note: this interview took place before the game) is 25,000 people, half of them Hispanic and rooting for the U.S.

Speculating Hispanics don’t have a reason to root for Sweden.

Depends on the women they know. But seriously, that could be the reality. I absolutely believe so. But it takes marketing, it takes a federation that wants to do it and prioritize it and make the Latin community feel included. They try now, but they need to try harder.

We all talk so much about player development, maybe we should be talking about PR development.

It’s for the sake of soccer in this country. I want to see the sport grow. I hope I can make a bit of difference. There are still a lot of bridges that need to be built between the communities.

Or repaired.

This is one way to do that. Look at it now in this political time where so much of the rhetoric is so anti-immigrant. Right away to be able to turn the tables and say ‘hey, maybe some people feel that way, but we embrace you. We want you. You are important to us.’ I wish ESPN would have paid attention to Blanco the same way they paid attention to Beckham. Or even half as much. If they had, they would have done themselves a huge favor. I know that they are trying really hard to make soccer ratings positive. I think some of their efforts are misguided; I definitely would do some things different – I would definitely seek more support from SportsCenter. Try to spend a little telling a few stories. I know they can’t go deep into stuff and all that because producers are scared to death about ratings. I’ve spoken to producers in the past, and they say that when they show soccer the numbers indicate people change the channel. They’re in the business of driving ratings, but if there is a mandate from the top saying ‘this is important to us and we should cover it like a news story.’ I’m not saying go crazy, but give me a few highlights. The ratings are similar to hockey and it almost has the importance of hockey, so I think it deserves the same coverage that hockey gets. Even if it’s a little notch below, show the highlights, goals, tell a small story, and oh by the way, “next Thursday DC United visits the Columbus Crew and the game will be on ESPN.” Drive people from outside of soccer to the soccer world, which they just don’t do. They have great promos and stuff, but they are only shown during the 2 and a half hour window when soccer is being shown. I’m very thankful for that window, its great, but they don’t tell anyone its going on. Most everybody watching knows you’re going to come back next Thursday with another game. You’re preaching to the choir. Put it on Monday Night Football, ok? Just a little ‘oh by the way, there is a soccer game televised on Thursday.’

I’d love to see a weekly soccer show. Thirty minutes out of the hours of poker is all I’m asking.

That would be fine, but I don’t even need that. I prefer 2 minutes on SportsCenter everyday.

But I can’t even sit through SportsCenter anymore. You’d have to watch 58 minutes of repeated stories on the major stories of the day before ever getting to soccer. I haven’t watched SportsCenter in years. It’s the CNN of sports: Started off as a godsend, ended up in the toilet of “expert analysis.” PTI is the only show I watch on ESPN besides actual games, even if Kornheiser is becoming the new Jim Rome of soccer idiots (at least Wilbon calls him out).

I love PTI.

What else can the greater media do to help propel the sport and its coverage into viable products?

It’s hard to say. Obviously the media’s number one job is to make money, so we have to understand it’s a business. If the business of soccer isn’t going to make them money than its understandable that they would not go that way, but in ESPN’s case, at the highest levels, they really believe in the sport. John Skipper is a huge fan and in part maybe betting a bit of his reputation that the sport is going to succeed. It’s surprising to me that there isn’t more of an effort. Its not him, its underneath him. There isn’t a coordinated effort around covering soccer. I understand that there is a level of how hard to push and what the line is between promoting something to death and covering it to death and covering it properly. But I don’t think soccer falls into that first category. There are a lot of things that get promoted on channels like ESPN that some people might think are over promoted. With soccer, we’re not at the point where it is even covered properly. Like I said, just a few minutes on SportsCenter, in line with hockey coverage, is not asking too much or over promoting it. SportsCenter is a huge vehicle especially when you consider ESPN holds the rights for the World Cup – properties they are trying to sell and want to make money on. They could build up to that with a few stories on American players. Maybe show one of the many goals Michael Bradley has scored this year on a Top Ten some place. Or talk about Dempsey who is Fulham’s leading scorer. Or Adu at Benfica. Little by little you are planting the seed that these guys are going to come back and play for the national team that oh by the way we will have for you on ESPN.

Not to mention Champion’s League which they have which would seem on the surface to be the easiest thing to sell.

They spend more time on Champion’s League than anything relating to domestic leagues or players. It’s obviously the elite club soccer event in the world and it deserves coverage. That is a good sign, but MLS and the American player deserves coverage as well. It’s here, they have some reason to cover it, even if only to promote their telecasts.

Where does Fox Soccer Channel fall into this discussion? Or due to the size and reach of ESPN, is it not really part of the discussion? Does soccer need ESPN?

Yes. They need it. I don’t know what FSC’s numbers are, and you have to love it for all the soccer they show. It’s a must have on the soccer fan’s cable system. But for soccer to grow you have to go outside the nest. You have to get the diehard sport fans – not all or even a lot, but some viewers, maybe the younger ones that use to play the sport and may be more open minded to the sport – to reconnect with the game. A great place to start is February 6th, Mexico vs. U.S. is there a better rivalry in sports right now than that? I don’t think mainstream America knows about this rivalry. It’s amazing rivalry with roots everywhere. It’s sad to see that the media doesn’t pay attention to it. And from there you have tournaments like Super Liga which had some great games and fits into that rivalry. This past year those were some of the most exciting if not the most exciting games of the entire year.

Does that give Futbol Mundial a chance to fill that gap? Maybe it’s a good thing for you. Could the lack of attention potentially allow you to expand into that void?

We’re at the mercy of the advertisers. That’s the bottom line. We want to expand; we’d love it to be no less than 40 pages every month, and the same thing goes for FM USA. But we’re not getting as much advertising support as we would like, honestly, as we deserve. I’m tooting out own horn here, but I think if you want to find soccer fans, we offer a great place to reach them. As do other soccer magazines that struggle. I don’t understand it. it’s like what else do we need to do? There are numerous places I would think we’d get advertising from that we don’t; it’s nuts. We have one beer advertiser. How do the Budweisers of the world stay away?

Do you have Best Buy? Seems they should he especially interested in FM given their recent moves.

They are not in, but hopefully they will. Everybody who has tested it – Home Depot does coupons with us for example - has done really well. Advertisers aren’t running away, but they aren’t running to us either. I just think those companies who have a vested interest in seeing the game succeed here should support the media, because the media can play such a large role. Maybe they don’t have the budgets for advertising after sponsoring MLS or whatever first.

Even outside the soccer world, from my experience and from what I read and hear, it seems a lot of companies are simply moving away from print into digital advertising and of course television which has that reach a magazine or newspaper just can’t equal.

I think that’s a big part of it. But in the Hispanic population the internet isn’t as prevalent as it is in English. Most people who follow soccer are going to pick up newspapers and magazines and watch TV and listen to the radio to get their information. It’s not going to be through the internet. The same demographics that apply to the typical American English reader do not apply to the Spanish speaking market.

That’s an interesting point. Is there something there besides the economics? Is it cultural?

I think economics plays a part but I think people like having something physical to pick up. Mexico City has like 20 daily newspapers and dozens of magazines.

I think that is still true to some degree here. I love the physical product as well, especially magazines, but unless I want a physical copy of say the New York Times Magazine, I’m not buying a newspaper. I don’t think many people my age or younger are either. It will be interesting to watch the market move and the media and advertisers reactions to it. Changing gears a bit, let’s hit on some player issues. I’m curious to know what you think about players moving abroad, and what is good for them and what is good for American soccer. Bryan Arguez is one right now that is kind of confusing to me. DC didn’t make much money off of him, so why sell him? I can only think that they don’t think he’ll be any good.

The part that I don’t understand and I haven’t asked the question which is probably why I don’t understand it, but what does a team like Hertha Berlin, a Bundesliga team, see in a kid that they are hot about that DC United couldn’t see him fit to get off the bench?

That’s my question.

Now maybe he doesn’t get off their bench and only plays reserve games, but they obviously see a future for him. Now maybe what they saw one day was a flash in the pan, but if this kid turns out to be good, it’s like what? DC United has made so many good decisions with their players so it is hard to question them, but too that just makes this all the more puzzling.

I used to all out support players moving to foreign leagues, but I’m beginning to wonder if Europe is the best destination. I think it is Feilhaber’s situation at Derby who has been pushing me to question my prior belief.

My thing with him is that when I first saw him I loved him, like so many people did. But now you are putting him in a league on a bad team – they may turn out to be one of the worst EPL teams in history. It’s about the system. I don’t think they understand him so he is rotting away on the bench. I think it’s a coach that sees him and thinks, “well, he doesn’t punt the ball 50 yards up the field with the quality that I want.” But that’s not his game. So maybe he is not suited for Derby’s version of the English game. He might fit better in a system like Arsenal. Of course he wouldn’t play there either probably, but in terms of how they play he might do better.

I’ll give you a case in point. Let’s go to basketball. Doug Christie played for the New York Knicks and rotted on the bench on a mostly defensive team that slowed the ball down and relied on passing the ball and team play to get points through a half-court offense designed by a really good coach, Jeff Van Gundy. But his offense is all about slowing the ball down. Christie finally gets out of New York, I think he spent a year or two in L.A. and then ended up in Sacramento, where he proceeded to become an all-star thriving on the run and gun offense that the Kings used. It’s the same player, it’s just a matter of coaching and systems.

That immediately makes me think of the Denver Broncos and their ability to make seemingly any running back and all-pro guy. I guess what makes it harder for me with soccer is the national team addition to the mix. You want to see these guys grow wherever they choose to go, and I don’t know if some of them are, but that is why you pay a coach and scouts and technical directors. They should know more than me, so I just sit and watch, often frustrated. Probably more with the EPL players than any. It’s hard to argue Bradley for example hasn’t grown.

But Benny wasn’t going anywhere in Hamburg. I’d love to see him go to a team that can appreciate his skills. I don’t think Derby is the place. I know Sunil and Coach Bradley worked to help that transfer happen. New EPL team, maybe not so much talent that Benny wouldn’t see the field. But if the coach doesn’t appreciate you, what’s the point? Here is a kid who’s potential is unlimited. Send him to Mexico. He would thrive there.

In that regard Freddy Adu may have made the best choice going to Benfica.

There are a lot of leagues where players can go and this is something I think they should have done with Freddy. When you have young teenagers coming into the professional arena, I think they should spend couple of months in places like Argentina in the winter. Go and hone your skills there and absorb the atmosphere, the training, the different kinds of players. Benny spent some of his childhood down there; go back.

I’m curious to see how the interest in American youth changes in the coming years beyond Europe. You rarely hear of American players going elsewhere.

There are four down in Mexico I think. Sonny Guadarrama and Edgar Castillo at Santos. There is one guy who plays for the U23 Mexican National team, Jesus Padilla from Chivas. It’s like, ‘how did the U.S. miss this kid?’ They’ve also called up Michael Orozco, a defender for San Luis, which is nice to see. it would be wonderful to see more American players play in Mexico, but hopefully the U.S. won’t let them all play for Mexico.

The number of players having these sort of choices and opportunities, from clubs to national teams, are only going to increase. It’s going to fun to watch it fall into place and see where players go and who has interest in them. And of course to see how the media follows it.

I’ll be watching closely, and in terms of Mexico and the Hispanic market, Futbol Mundial will be covering it.

Well you know I’ll be reading.

—-
banner photo credit: New York Times